how and why to use HCG

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

preqnyl

Hi Ronnie T, Yhanks for getting back to me. I would like to know how to use this product, do you use it like hgh? Also, it say's to use 500iu every 3 day's then I read every 5 day's. How many iu=1mg? Thanks Marz.
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Here an old article I posted on BoS
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...as promised I've translated my article from Bodypage.nl, but remember I'm Dutch you'll find some grammatical errors..enjoy..

Use of Clomid & HCG during cycle and tapering.


Even though there are masses articles which give a sufficient answer on these problems, on the Internet forums always exist diagrams and opinions, that brings doubt in the user, below the original diagram that in innumerable derivatives, exists on the net:
Steroid Time afterlast administration Length ofClomid Cycle
Anadrol50/Anapolan50: 8 - 12 hours 3 weeks
Deca durabolan: 3 weeks 4 weeks
Dianabol: 4 - 8 hours 3 weeks
Equipoise: 17 - 21 days 3 weeks
Finajet/Trenbolone: 3 days 3 weeks
Primabolan depot: 10 - 14 days 2 weeks
Sustanon: 3 weeks 3 weeks
Testosterone Cypionate: 2 weeks 3 weeks
Testosterone Enanthate/Testoviron: 2 weeks 3 weeks
Testosterone Propionate: 3 days 3 weeks
Testosterone Suspension: 4 - 8 hours 2-3 weeks
Winstrol 8 - 12 hours 2-3 weeks
This diagram assumes the fact that one could not use Clomid in fact during the cycle, and that use, during the time that the longest working steroid that you have used is still operative, is purely waste. Now, you know that established experts in this area do not always agree with each other, by long ,and that science reverses sometimes long adopted securities entirely. You do not have to listen therefore to those self-proclaimed gurus. However, I have brought together as many data as possible and empirical data from own and other people's experiences in the hope that you have a practical use for it. It seemed like a good idea to Ren? of bringing together these practical experiences including dosings, you can expect therefore also more of us in this area such as which anabolics, in which proportions fit well to go together. Well.........

Anti-oestrogens:
There are two groups in different manners operative anti-oestrogens, first there are the competitive aromatase inhibitors, such as Cytadren, Arimidex and probable also Proviron, these bind at the same place on the enzyme aromatase such as testosterone does. By doing this, they prevent that testosterone binds itself and then converts to oestrogen. Secondly there is the group: oestrogen receptor antagonists, that with their molecules strongly bind to the receptor, but do not activate this receptor and make him this way inaccessible for the appropriate hormone, Clomid (clomiphene) and Nolvadex (tamoxifen) belong to this group. These two look a lot a like and belong to the triphenylethylenes, and therefore are no steroids. Both equals each other strongly in their functioning , and have a dual functioning, in some tissues they behave themselves as oestrogen?s and in other tissues as an antagonist. Both work as oestrogen?s in the bone tissue, and that is only good because differently this would lead to osteoporosis , BUT only Tamoxifen work pronounced strong in the liver as an oestrogen, and this way the growth factors slow down, particularly IGF-1. Use of tamoxifen shows strongly decreased IGF-1 levels. What does this mean in real life? Like we know growth hormone (somatropine) thanks a large part, as not all, his functioning to IGF-1. The stimulating impact that assumes the oral component, concretely the Dianabol or Oxymetholone, care for an improved cycle. This due the stimulation of the liver, the more IGF-1 or other (still) unknown growth factors are released. This together with the receptor related muscle growth of the injected resources, have a synergistisc impact. If you use ALSO Nolvadex therefore during that cycle, you annul this synergy. Clomid does not have these disadvantages and therefore strongly enjoy the preference, especially if you?re on a very expensive GH cycle.

Therefore, these two in the Netherlands and Belgium in abundance available anti-oestrogenen Clomid strongly enjoy the preference, is Nolvadex therefore worthless? No off course not, it is really an anti-oestrogen in b.a the nipples, and many keep a packing at hand in case they think a gyno starts to develop. Although in my opinion Clomid in this regard is also very well suitable, in such an emergency case, on the first day you can take swallow 300mg Clomid, that is six 50 mg/tablets , that you use in two portions, the following days you take just 50 mg/day. By its unusually long half life of 5 days Clomid at long-term use, builds up an operative amount of 300 mg. As a fist rule it is adopted that after the cycle, the athlete uses for 10 days - 100 mg Clomid is used, followed by 10 days - 50 mg. Is this the law? No off course not, it works as said as an antagonist for the oestrogenic receptor. Raised progestogene - or oestrogen levels (yes, really) ensure just like raised testosterone levels a reduced endogenous testosterone production. Clomid reduces therefore the inhibition as a result of the raised oestradiol levels. With that the LH levels (this hormone "reflects command" to the testes to produce testosterone) return to their normal altitude, that on its turn ensures that the testosterone level standardise themselves. Some users mean that a twenty days use of Clomid is sufficiently, others think that they need a longer period, especially as a result of longer and heavier cycles. Use in males has followed scientifically until a full year without detrimental side effects. There exists a broadly spread misconception that Clomid only can be used for some weeks, that?s indeed printed in the leaflet, but these have been intended for women with a fertility jamming. And women must use it no longer then two use weeks because of their ovulation.

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

Clomid during the complete cycle? Yes, why not? It costs almost nothing and has much more qualities than only anti-oestrogen square, it works also to improve blood values (LDL against HDL), and these become nevertheless already more badly with AAS-use, it accelerates convalescence after the cycle, and improved mood (female hormone related depressions). Clomid cannot prevent oppression of Pituary-Hypothalamus-Testes-Axis even if it is used during the whole cycle, there also exist the androgenic inhibition by means of the androgenic receptor, that has nothing to do with the estrogenic receptor. Androgenic inhibition is inevitably and cannot be prevented by Clomid as oestrogenic receptor antagonist, but it diminishes, without questioning, the total degree of oppression (inhibition).

What about the former group of Arimidex, Cytadren and Proviron??

Competitive aromatase remmers (CAR) compete with the normal substrate (b.a injected and body-own testosterone) for the bound to the aromatase enzyme (competition). At equal bindings affinity (Arimidex here is an exception, but about this more later) the CAR always must be raised, as the quantities of used steroids are being raised. If there are more testosterone molecules available than CAR molecules, the enzyme will be mainly bound by testosterone and will mainly produce oestrogen. Cytadren should not be higher dosed than 250 mg per day and this is sufficient to compensate 1000 mg testosteron. In the ideal situation you must add 50 mg Clomid for earlier-mentioned reasons and also Proviron. Proviron are possible you simply as from day 1 use and intensify thedosering to need to 4 tablets per day. If you use more than 4 tablets per day there chance on prapiarisme (apermanent erectie) exists that only by a doctor with an injection in the shaft of the penis can be remedied. Proviron raised moreover the quantity ejaculaat and simplify therefore also it "finish" something what becomes by the androgenen swollen prostate at some more difficult. Proviron also work as anti-oestrogen in a the same manner asArimidex. Moreover Proviron bind themselves to the SHGB (sex hormone binding globuline) and ensures this way that there can be more "free" testosteron present in the blood to preferm its beneficial effect on the muscle increase. Proviron seems to raise the libido also directly. A real magic cycle therefore (read more concerning the separatere sources under" profiles "on this site). Arimidex has an exceptionally strong bindings affinity, therefore you need only an extreme small amount, even 1 mg is for 1 gramme testosteron largely sufficient. A minus is that Arimidex is correspondingly expensive, exception on this is Arimidex of IP China, wich we tested as sufficiently dosed.

Cytadren then but, I think that only few of you have had this product actually in their hands. It is especially much used in the US, for this reason here just as short profile, because it is i.m.o. also in fact a bad article for our purposes. Cytadren has also a dual function. It’s used in high amounts (1000 mg/dag) as a medecine at patients with the Cushing's syndrome, where these patients produce abnormally high quantities of cortisol. Cytadren works by inhibiting the enzyme desmolase, that is necessary for all stero?d productions in the body, and inhibits the production of cortisol. At 250 mg per day cytadren sit, what concerns the aromatase inhibition on its highest level, if you raise hereafter the amount of Cytadren it will no longer influence the enzyme aromatase, but the inhibition of desmolase enzyme increases all the more. That is nevertheless well, because everyone knows that cortisol works catabolic (breaks down muscle). It has been proven however that abnormally high cortisol levels work catabolic, but that through Cytadren use abnormally reduced cortisol levels also does not result in increased muscle growth. However, developes side effects such as painful joints and lethargy. Enough concerning this product, if someone nevertheless should want to know more concerning this product, he can contact me.


Winstrol.

A large part of the stero?ds which you use becomes in the body unusable because they bind themselves to the SHGB. If we would be therefore able to raise the quantity of "free" testosterone by reducing the SHGB level, this would be a splendid solution. A scientific research has shown that orally taken Winstrol one of these bindings proteins namely globuline reduces with 50% . If you therefore uses tablets Winstrol during your cycle, you make it more effective. Winstrol also works as androgenic component also like an anti-oestrogen on b.a your libido problem. Moreover works the combination oral Winstrol/Proviron to an unprecedented muscle compactness and muscle hardness. While we are talking concerning compounds that have positive effects on the "free testosterone", I want nevertheless concerning this effect point to Testosterone Undecanoate, this everywhere vilified oral testosterone has shown in scientific researches, that it can reduce the SHBG with at least 50% and at long-term use still much further. More about this later, because I go astray.

How and when to use HCG.

HCG (Human Chorionoc Gonadotrophine) is no steroid, but a peptide hormone. It is produced in the placenta (mother wafer) at pregnant women. It is won from the urine of pregnant women. Many miss-informed bodybuilders use it together with Clomid to start endogenous production again after a cycle, this however works counter-productive. The HCG works on the LH receptor just like LH itself, therefore like an agonist. As a consequence, the endogenous testosteronproduction as well as the oestrogen production increases, with as a result aromatising. These facts together provide a further inhibition of HPT-Axis by means of the feedback. One injects normally, as a result from this mis-information 1 ampoule every three days (2500 iu or 5000 iu) after the cycle, this provides thanks to aromatisation of the high endogenous testosteronproduction, for an abnormal high oestrogen level, that can be responsible for many cases of gynaecomastia. Completely wrong therefore!!!
As from week 5, you can inject every three/four days + 500 iu. If you have to prepare the whole amount of 2500 iu or 5000 iu, you can keep the rest in an empty vial of b.a. Norma Hellas in the fridge. For about two weeks you can use HCG, subcutaneously (under the skin) with an insulin needle, to reduce atrophy (shrink) of the testes (seed balls), if this side effect occurs. Because strongly shrunk testes are not able to produce sufficient endogenous testosterone after the cycle. It is however for those who prefer IM also complete well possible to inject HCG IM (intramuscularly, in the muscle).
Briefly and concisely, right?

Nov.2002.. Ronny...

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

case study

Case study: hCG restores testosterone production after steroids use
That hCG restores the natural production of testosterone in chemical athletes is very very old news. But strange as it may seem, there are hardly any scientific studies in which doctors have given hCG to steroids users. One of the few studies we?ve come across is the medical case study described by the British doctor Geoff Gill, published at the end of the nineties in the Postgraduate Medical Journal. Gill, who at the time worked at the Walton Hospital in Liverpool, wrote the article after he had treated a chemical athlete who had become impotent at the age of 17.

The young bodybuilder had gone to a doctor because he was worried about a varicose vein in his scrotum. What?s more he?d been impotent for 4 months, had no libido, bad quality sperm and sore nipples.
The cause quickly became clear to the doctors. The man was a competitive bodybuilder, and had been using steroids for at least six months before he became impotent. The man himself had no idea that his complaint had been caused by the steroids, "as he felt he had been taking 'safe anabolics'. It was difficult to obtain an accurate drug history, but the man had taken nandrolone, Sustanon, and possibly stanozolol. When he could, he took danazol to counteract nipple tenderness."
The bodybuilder?s pituitary gland was no longer producing LH or FSH, the doctors discovered.
The bodybuilder wanted to continue using steroids. As the doctors wanted to limit the damage they prescribed the least harmful steroids they could think of: Sustanon 250. The man was given an injection once every two weeks. He reacted well to this: his impotence disappeared and his libido returned.
After fifteen months the man gave up bodybuilding and turned his attention to his studies. Of his own accord he stopped the testosterone injections. The inevitable happened: his complaints returned. His testosterone level plummeted from 14.0 to 8.5 nanomol/l.



"To stimulate testicular function he was given injections of HCG over the next three months (10.000 units I.M. weekly for one month, 5.000 units weekly for one month, and 2500 units for one month)", wrote Gill. "Within a week of starting treatment, libido had greatly improved, and spontaneous nocturnal ejaculations occurred. Serum testosterone levels and potency returned to normal over the three months of treatment."
Gill was positive about the choice of treatment. HCG works, he claims. But soon after the injections were stopped, the man?s testosterone level sank even lower than before he started with the hCG injections. It?s a question you?ll never get an answer to, but we pose it nonetheless. Wouldn?t the bodybuilder?s own testosterone production have been restored more quickly if he had not had hCG?
Source:
Postgrad Med J 1998 Jan; 74(867): 45-6.