There is no such thing as a fatburning steroid cycle- its a myth , absurd,idiotic....

[Xxplosive Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Xxplosive]

Let me tell you this, brother... It has been years since I have taken ECA, and I can DEFINITELY feel this batch.

And I'm somebody that has a very high tolerance for fat burners and substances of this nature.

Just trying to slim down to 230, maybe even a bit lower, before I start this cycle.

[xamo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close xamo]

Your adrenals and or recptors are Burnt to a crisp, this happends when you use too much too many times. Take a lay off from ECA . Try to build up your adrenals with some nutrition- google adrenl burnout

Considering that I haven't touched a pre work out or any stims in over 2 months, it is not medically possible...

[xamo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close xamo]

Again NO STEROID DIRECTLY BURNS FAT- fact . However consider Testosterone that we men have more than females naturally and we are the leaner gender becasue of it. Building muscle increases metabolism, therfore you will burn more fat. You guys that think you are burning fat from steroids are just training and eating correctly and more power to you all- but its the increase in muscle, the prevention of new fat storage that is making you leaner- NOT THE GEAR.

Its like the kid who injects helios into his abs , while he diets and trains for a contest - his total BF % decreases so he thinks the helios spot reduced his abs when NO NO NO NO- it just got leaner like it naturally would have from all his hard efforts. Just like you XPLOSIVE- you are experiencing the effects of doing everything right, ITS NOT THE GEAR . Yes you are right you are not experienced and with respect let me tell you - you are mistaken- Ive seen and worked with 100s of 20 something kids like you- Just keep doing what you are doing cuz you are doing it correctly. When you hit your 30s and 40s and the metabolism slows- Then come talk to me and Ill prove it all over again

You do realize that my post pretty much was siding with yours? :/ And that nowhere did I say that steroids had a direct impact on fat loss?

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

cy

for discussion purposes

Your Guide to Losing Fat While "On"
by Cy Willson


So you wanna drop some fat and you wanna' do it at breakneck speed, huh? What's that? You also want to retain all your muscle mass while greatly reducing calories? Man, you want it all, don't you? Well, it can be done, if you take the proper precautions.


We all know the danger of a super strict diet: potential muscle loss. Who wants to look ripped if you have to lose a lot of hard-earned muscle to get there? Of course, you could go on a sensible diet and slowly drop the fat, but hey, where's the fun in that? Besides, we're in a hurry here!


Many people choose to use steroids while on a severe diet to stave off any possible muscle loss. But which ones and how much? And how should you eat while "on"? Our junior guru Cy Willson has the answers for you. And don't worry, if steroids aren't your bag, he'll also provide some legal alternatives to help you rapidly drop the fat while keeping the muscle.



The Real Anabolic Diet


At one time or another, everyone involved in bodybuilding decides to shed the fat and "see what's under there." With those that use anabolic steroids , this effort has always included the use of drugs that have gained a reputation for their so-called "hardening effect."


Most have attributed this "hardening effect" to a simple reduction in water retention. For example, Joe Blow is using 1,000 mg of Testosterone enanthate per week along with 50 mg per day of methandrostenolone for a course of six to eight weeks. He stops using those two drugs on the ninth week and switches to androgens which cause less water retention. This lack of water retention is the effect referred to as "hardening," right? Actually, I don't think that's the entire story.


True, the reduction in water does play a role. However, I also think certain steroids are much more potent than others in terms of reducing adipose tissue and/or inhibiting the uptake of triglycerides into adipose tissue. Think about it: androgens vary in terms of their anabolic effects upon muscle tissue, so why would this be any different in terms of their effects on the reduction of adipose tissue?


I'll go over my reasoning behind this in the body of my article, as well as provide a list of drugs that are best suited for a fat loss phase. I'll also include a diet plan that will greatly accelerate the reduction of adipose tissue.


Don't worry, I'll also include a "steroid alternative" section which will consist of prohormone usage for those of you who don't like to worry about DEA agents, phone taps, and undercover officers dressed like fitness bunnies, which only paranoid bastards like me worry about anyway.



The AR (Androgen Receptor)


There are many mechanisms behind the ability of androgens to reduce body fat. However, one key determinant of the amount of adipose tissue reduced is that particular androgen's ability to bind to the AR.


I need to mention that most androgens interact with both AR and GR (Glucocorticoid Receptors). We'll touch on that later. For now, let me explain why it matters how well an androgen binds to the AR in terms of reducing adipose tissue. Most of you know that ARs are present in tissue such as muscle. This is one of the mechanisms behind their ability to induce muscular hypertrophy. Now what does this have to do with body fat? Simple, AR's are present in adipose tissue as well. (1)


What does this mean? Well, it's been shown that the higher the density of ARs, the more that lipid uptake is inhibited. (2) It's also been shown that androgens that bind avidly to the AR cause an increase or upregulation of AR in adipocytes. (1) I think the greater the androgen binds to the AR, the more upregulation of AR in adipocytes occurs. This would lead to a significant reduction in subcutaneous adipose tissue. (3)


Notice that I specifically mentioned subcutaneous adipose tissue (fat right beneath the skin) and not visceral adipose tissue (fat around the internal organs). Why did I bother to differentiate between the two? Simple. For the most part, we bodybuilders are concerned only with subcutaneous adipose tissue. Visceral fat doesn't have much of an effect on a person's appearance. For that reason, we're only concerning ourselves with subcutaneous adipose tissue.


Now, what other mechanisms of action can account for the effects seen with those steroids that bind tightly to the AR? Well, those that bind tightly to the AR will decrease LPL (Lipoprotein Lipase), which is an enzyme that causes lipid accumulation. (4) They may also decrease Acetyl-CoA Carboxylase and Fatty Acid Synthetase.(5)


Another interesting note is that androgens have been shown to increase adenyl cylclase as well. This is the enzyme which is responsible for the conversion of cytoplasmic ATP into cyclic AMP. Increasing its concentrations is a good thing, in other words.



The Glucocorticoid Receptor (GR)


There are certain androgens that can interact with GRs and this may very well be another mechanism behind their ability to induce a loss of adipose tissue. The mechanism? Well, the binding of cortisol to the GR can cause an increase in LPL. (6,7,8) This isn't what we want if we're trying to drop body fat, as LPL causes lipid accumulation. So, certain androgens may prevent lipid accumulation through this mechanism.


Some androgens may do one of two things — or possibly even both — in order to lower LPL levels in adipose tissue. That is, they may bind to the GR and thus prevent cortisol from binding and increasing LPL activity, or they may downregulate the number of GRs in adipose tissue. (9, 10, 11)



Microsomal Receptors (MR)


The last mechanism involves the presence of the AR in subcellular fractions. To be more specific, the AR has been identified in microsomal portions of the cell. So what does this mean? Certain androgens are able to bind to the AR in microsomes and carry out a posttranscriptional effect. In fact, it appears that out of all the available androgens, stanozolol (Winstrol ) is able to bind to this receptor while all others (with the possible exception of danazol) are not.


If you couple this with the idea that the AR is present in the subcellular fractions of adipose tissue — or the microsomes to be more specific — this can account for its ability to induce fat loss. (12,13,14)


Now, with the above information, we can put together a "stack" of androgens which should accelerate the reduction in adipose tissue in a somewhat synergistic manner.



The "Grocery" List


Trenbolone


This particular steroid has recently gained back some popularity, mainly due to the fact that there's now a high quality version available, namely GAC's Humatren. What exactly makes this steroid so special? Glad you asked.


First off, it's been shown to bind to the AR greater than Testosterone and even nandrolone . (15) This ability to bind so avidly to the AR is probably one of the reasons why this steroid is so effective at accelerating fat loss. The thing that makes it unique from other androgens, however, is that it's been shown to bind avidly to the GR as well. (15,16) This effect wasn't seen with Testosterone or nandrolone.

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

more

Oxandrolone (Optional)


This androgen has been shown to decrease subcutaneous abdominal fat to a greater degree than Testosterone and nandrolone, even though the dosages employed with oxandrolone were much lower. On a milligram-per-milligram basis, oxandrolone is much more potent that Testosterone and nandrolone in terms of reducing adipose tissue. (17)


So how does that happen? Even though I can't say for sure, it appears that oxandrolone binds rather well to the AR, possibly even more so than Testosterone or nandrolone. This would explain the difference in adipose tissue reductions. A study performed in young men also demonstrated that oxandrolone likely exerts its effects via the AR.


Another interesting note is that oxandrolone induced an increase in AR expression in muscle. (18) Now, if we apply this to what I was talking about in the first portion of this article, it makes sense that oxandrolone would be potent at reducing adipose tissue. Assuming that it's increasing AR expression in adipose tissue as well, this fits perfectly in to the idea that a strong binding to the AR induces upregulation of the AR content in adipose tissue and thus leads to lipolytic effects.


Testosterone


This king of androgens should also be included for a few reasons. From what I've seen, it appears that Testosterone is unique in that it's been shown to increase the number of beta adrenergic receptors (this phenomenon can increase the effectiveness of beta-2 agonists like ephedrine and clenbuterol as well as exercise induced lipolysis) and may also alter Hormone Sensitive Lipase (HSL) in a positive manner.(19,20,21) Whether or not other androgens can do this to the same degree, I'm uncertain, but I'm taking precautions here.


Stanozolol (Winstrol)


As I noted earlier, this androgen is unique in that it binds to the microsomal AR in adipose tissue in order to exert its effects.



The Stack


In case you didn't notice, the three main ingredients in this stack are trenbolone, Testosterone, and stanozolol. Using these three drugs can cover all three mechanisms that can accelerate lipolysis. (Before I move on, I must say that there's still a myriad of things we don't know about anabolic steroids. That includes all mechanisms of action.) So, here's the "fat attack" stack:



300 mg per week trenbolone acetate



As a side note, the only brand of trenbolone I'll recommend with confidence in terms of both efficacy and sterility is GAC's Humatren. I don't want people complaining to me about infections or sickness from using a home brew or a vet product. If you have the "hook up," I recommend you take advantage of it and if you don't, start making some contacts! (Just don't e-mail us about it, buddy.)



250-300 mg per week Testosterone



The specific ester isn't that big of a deal in this case, but a blend like Sostenon would work nicely.



350 mg per week stanozolol



If you're injecting this amount, the only brand I can recommend with confidence is Zambon.



25-50 mg per day of methandrostenolone (Explanation below)



As an option, you can possibly substitute oxandrolone for trenbolone but you'd then have to add some rather potent anti-glucocorticoids like fluoxymesterone or methandrolstenolone. It simplifies things to just use trenbolone. If money is of no concern however, you can add oxandrolone in with the stack at around 25 mg per day, along with trenbolone.


As a side note, I'd also like to recommend using methandrostenolone (D-bol) at a dosage of around 25 to 50 mg per day. This is because of this particular steroid's ability to increase dopamine levels. Now before you freak out because I'm recommending a drug used to "bulk up," I'd like you to realize a few things. First, this increase in dopamine can be very beneficial in terms of reducing adipose tissue. I've always noticed this effect while using the drug, as have others. As long as you're in the 25 to 50 mg per day range, you shouldn't see much water retention. If it bothers you that much, you can simply drop the D-bol out a week or two prior to when you want to look your leanest.


While the notion that methandrostenolone increases dopamine levels may be a little controversial, I stand behind my assertion. My reasoning? Well, certain effects/side effects seen with the drug share the exact characteristics of increased dopamine levels: increased heart rate, insomnia, feelings of well being, increased libido, increased blood pressure accompanied by a headache and yes, a slight anorectic effect.


Not only this, but one study demonstrated the drug's ability to increase dopamine synthesis whereas all other androgens tested had no effect. (22) So what do these increased levels of dopamine do? Well, dopamine exerts the following effects either directly or indirectly via conversion to norepinephrine and epinephrine: appetite suppression, activation of beta-3 receptors (which can lead to increased oxygen consumption of brown adipose tissue as well as prevent insulin stimulated glucose uptake into white adipocytes), decreased insulin levels, decreased Lipoprotein Lipase (LPL) activity in adipose tissue, stimulated oxygen consumption in general, and increased Resting Energy Expenditure (REE). So, in general, all this will enhance lipolysis. (23-30)


Just for safety, I'd also like you to monitor your blood pressure very closely if you're also taking some type of stimulant (ephedrine/caffeine) in combo with your steroid stack. These also increase norepinephrine and epinephrine. If you experience headaches and/or increased blood pressure, either lower your D-bol dosage or cut down the stimulants. You could also drop the stimulants completely.



The Legal Eagle Alternative: Prohormones or Pro-Steroids


I realize that some of you don't want to get involved in illegal activities. For those of you who want to play it safe, you can take the prohormone route. You'd need to use a prohormone that binds to the AR along with another that exerts its effects through a mechanism that's independent of the AR.


So, you have the option of using something like 4-androstenediol and norandrostenediol, which apparently don't bind very well to the AR but exert their effects via other mechanisms. What's out there we can use that's able to bind to the AR? Well, until now, it appears there wasn't one available. However, Biotest's MAG-10 contains a compound which binds avidly to the AR, which is A1-E. MAG-10 also contains a highly bioavailable form of 4-AD (4-AD-EC) whose effects are non-AR mediated. (For more info, read the article here.)


Another benefit is that some 4-AD converts to Testosterone via the enzyme 3 Beta-HSD. While 4-AD is apparently very anabolic all on its own, it's also been shown to elevate endogenous Testosterone in men to a mid-high to high level, but still within the normal range through the aforementioned conversion.


So with MAG-10, it appears as though you hit three different mechanisms that will help you to accelerate fat loss. This combination should produce a potent synergism that will enable you to drop body fat at the rate you would while on anabolic steroids. The only difference is that MAG-10 is perfectly legal.



The Diet Plan


No amount of 'roids will make up for a crappy diet, so I'll provide a plan for you to follow. Don't worry, this won't be too complicated. First, I'd like you to consume between 50 to 120 grams of carbohydrates per day to keep T3 at a respectable level. Now, whether you consume 50 or 120 grams is "weight dependent," meaning that if you're 200 pounds or less, consume 50 grams per day. If you're above 200, consume 100 to 120 grams of carbs per day. You have two options with carb intake:



Option #1: Split your total carb intake in half and consume one portion early in the day so your workouts don't suffer. Then consume the other half after your workout.


Option #2: Consume your total daily carbohydrate allotment after your workout.



Either way, I recommend that you consume Biotest Surge post workout and tailor the amount used according to your carbohydrate requirements.


As for protein requirements, I'd like you to consume at least 1.5 grams per pound of body weight.


Lastly, I want you to consume 25 to 35 grams of fat per day with the majority of those calories coming from omega 3 fatty acids: fish oil, flax oil, walnuts, etc. Again, 25 grams if you're 200 pounds or under and 35 if you're over 200.

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

So let's use a 200 pound guy as an example:



200 x 1.5 = 300 grams of protein


200 pounds = 50 grams of carbohydrates


200 pounds = 25 grams of fat


Total calories = 1625




Daily Example of Food Intake



Meal 1 — Around 45 grams of protein and 4 grams of fat (fish oil capsules)


Meal 2-5 — Same


Biotest Surge for post workout (2 scoops = 49 grams of carbs, 25 grams protein. The amount of fat is trivial so we won't factor it in)


Meal 6 — Same as meal 1




Essentially, I want you to consume almost nothing but protein and fat throughout the day for each of your meals. I believe it would be optimal to consume near-zero carbohydrates throughout the day and for post workout purposes, consume Surge. Then go back to your protein and fat meals. Now if you absolutely can't work out without consuming carbs shortly before exercise, then you can consume around half of your total daily intake early in the day as I stated previously.


Also, if you absolutely need a protein source that has a rather high amount of fat, (salmon, steak, etc.), then you may subtract the fat grams from a certain amount of meals and then consume whatever it is you wanted to eat. For instance, if you had a protein source that contained 12 grams of fat, you could skip the addition of fat to three of your other meals.


I know some of you may think this amount of calories is too low, but you have to remember we have the anti-catabolic/anabolic effect of androgens on our side. This will not only aid in fat loss, but will allow us to maintain our lean body mass to a significant degree.


In case you didn't notice, this plan is to be employed when you wish to drop a significant amount of body fat in a short amount of time. If time isn't an issue, then you may increase your calories. However, I still think the above formula will prove most effective for your goal.



A Final Note


Let's all do our part in dispelling the idea of reduced water retention as the main mechanism for which the "hardening effect" occurs. I hope you'll use the stacks and diet I've outlined above when you wish to drop body fat at an accelerated rate while greatly minimizing loss of lean body mass. Give it a try and I promise you'll be satisfied. Every successful bodybuilder I know follows this same basic plan. Plus, it's what I use!


Now get to it!



References Cited

1. Dieudonne MN, et al. "Androgen receptors in human preadipocytes and adipocytes: regional specifities and regulation by sex steroids." Am J Physiol 1998 Jun;274(6 Pt 1): C1645-52


2. Sjogren J, et al. "Androgen binding hormone to adipose tissue in rats." Biochim Biophys Acta 1995 May 11;1244(1):117-20


3. De Pergola G, et al. "Up-regulation of androgen receptor binding in male rat fat pad adipose precursor cells exposed to testosterone: study in a whole cell assay system." J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol 1990 Nov 30;37(4):553-8


4. Xu X, et al. "The effects of androgens on the regulation of lipolysis in adipose precursor cells." Endocrinology 1990 Feb;126(2):1229-34


5. Burch L, et al. "Effect of anabolic steroids on lipogenic and lipolytic enzymes in sheep tissues." Horm Metab Res 1982 Jan;14(1):52-3


6. Pedersen SB, et al. "Characterization of regional and gender differences in glucocorticoid receptors and lipoprotein lipase activity in human adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1994 Jun;78(6):1354-9


7. Ottosson M, et al. "The effects of cortisol on the regulation of lipoprotein lipase activity in human adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1994 Sep;79(3):820-5


8. Samra JS, et al. "Effects of physiological hypercortisolemia on the regulation of lipolysis in subcutaneous adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1998 Feb;83(2):626-31


9. Mayer M, Rosen F. "Interaction of anabolic steroids with glucocorticoid receptor sites in rat muscle cytosol." Am J Physiol 1975 Nov;229(5):1381-6


10. Ottosson M, et al. "Blockade of the glucocorticoid receptor with RU 486: effects in vitro and in vivo on human adipose tissue lipoprotein lipase activity." Obes Res 1995 May;3(3):233-40


11. Kerr JE, et al. "Androgens modulate glucocorticoid receptor mRNA, but not mineralcorticoid receptor mRNA levels, in the rat hippocampus." J Neuroendocrinol 1996 Jun;8(6):439-47


12. Steinsapir J, Muldoon TG. "Role of microsomal receptors in steroid hormone action." Steroids 1991 Feb;56(2):66-71


13. Boada LD, et al. "Identification of a specific binding site for the anabolic steroid stanozolol in male rat liver microsomes." J Pharmacol Exp Their 1996 Dec;279(3):1123-9


14. McCann JP, et al. "Subcellular distribution and glycosylation patterns of adrogen receptor from sheep omental adipose tissue." J Endocrinol 2001 Jun;169(3):587-93


15. Danhaive PA, Rousseau GG. "Binding of glucocorticoid antagonists to androgen and glucocorticoid hormone receptors in rat skeletal muscle." J Steroid Biochem 1986 Feb;24(2):481-7


16. Danhaive PA, Rousseau GG. "Evidence for sex-dependent anabolic response to androgenic steroids mediated by muscle glucocorticoid receptors in the rat." J Steroid Biochem 1988 Jun;29(6):575-81


17. Lovejoy JC, et al. "Oral anabolic steroid treatment, but not parental androgen treatment, decreases abdominal fat in obese, older men." Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 1995 Sep;19(9):614-24


18. Sheffield-Moore M, et al. "Oxandrolone administration stimulates net muscle protein synthesis in young men." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1999 Aug;84(8):2705-11


19. Xu X, et al. "Postreceptor events involved in the up-regulation of beta-adrenergic receptor mediated lipolysis by testosterone in rat white adipocytes." Endocrinology 1993 April;132(4):1651-7


20. De Pergola G. "The adipose tissue metabolism: role of testosterone and dehydroepiandrosterone." Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 2000 Jun;24 Suppl 2:S59-63


21. Marin P, et al. "Assimilation and mobilization of triglycerides in subcutaneous abdominal and femoral adipose tissue in vivo in men: effects of androgens." J Clin Endrocrinol Metab 1995 Jan;80(1):239-43


22. Thiblin I, et al. "Increased dopaminergic and 5-hydroxytyrptaminergic activities in male rat brain following long-term treatment with anabolic/androgenic steroids." Br J Pharmacol 1999 Mar;126(6):1301-6


23. Samanin R, Garattini S. "Neurochemical mechanism of action of anorectic drugs." Pharmacol Toxicol 1993 Aug;73(2):63-8


24. Maxwell G, et al. "The effect of dopamine upon oxidative metabolism of brown fat adipocytes." Eur J Pharmacol 1985 Oct 22;116(3):293-7


25. Sandyk R. "Dopamine and insulin interact to modulate in vitro glucose transport in rat adipocytes." Int J Neurosci 1988 Nov;43(1-2):9-14


26. Lee TL, et al. "Activation of beta 3-adrenoreceptors by exogenous dopamine to lower glucose uptake into rat adipocytes." J Auton Nerv Syst 1998 Dec 11;74(2-3):86-90


27. Maxwell GM, et al. "Thermogenesis and the effect of injected catecholamines on the oxygen consumption of cafeteria-fed rats." Clin Exp Pharmacol Physiol 1988 May;15(5):391-400


28. Nakagawa M, et al. "The effects of dopamine infusion on the postoperative energy expenditure, metabolism, and catecholamine levels of patients after esophagectomy." Surg Today 1994;24(8):688-93


29. Pernet A, et al. "The metabolic effects of dopamine in man." Eur J Clin Pharmacol 1984;26(1):23-8


30. Zhang Y, et al. "Bromocriptine/SKF38393 treatment ameliorates dyslipidemia in ob/ob mice." Metabolism 1999 Aug;48(8):1033-40

[stallion Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close stallion]

Ronny, 2 questions. How do you figure out the carb and fat macros? Say, for a 250 lb guy. Does carb and fat stay the same as the 200 lb guy or is there a formula to figure them out?

And, what about the natural trainer or the guy off cycle? Do you recommend this for them? Thanks?

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

Bro,

It was Cy Wilson who wrote this.

Guideline from the article are in gams/pound of bodyweight.

As for protein requirements, I'd like you to consume at least 1.5 grams per pound of body weight.

Lastly, I want you to consume 25 to 35 grams of fat per day with the majority of those calories coming from omega 3 fatty acids: fish oil, flax oil, walnuts, etc. Again, 25 grams if you're 200 pounds or under and 35 if you're over 200.

[RonnyT Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RonnyT]

more science

As Ketsugo said; no steroid directly burns fat. But.. with all obese people today the scientific community and the big Pharma’s look for an edge to find a way to make people slimmer/leaner. As is said testosterone plays a role – in our youth with high levels of Test we are very active and this also helps burning fat. Also more muscle and muscles burn fat, also in rest.

I plan to make a blogpost. Summarising all info on scientific research involving “our” roids.
You can help me if you like.


Exogenous androgens influence body composition and regional body fat distribution in obese postmenopausal women--a clinical research center study.
Lovejoy et all 1996 ,
Abstract
Abdominal fat distribution is influenced by androgen levels in both men and women. The purpose of this study was to assess the effects on fat distribution of administering nandrolone decanoate (ND; an anabolic steroid with weak androgenic activity) or spironolactone (SP; an antiandrogen) in obese postmenopausal women. The design was a randomized, placebo-controlled, 9-month trial with simultaneous calorie restriction for weight loss. Women in all three groups lost comparable amounts of weight, but the ND-treated women gained lean mass relative to the other two groups (P < 0.0005) and lost more body fat than women in the SP group (P < 0.01). The resting metabolic rate also increased slightly in the ND group. ND treatment produced a gain in visceral fat, as determined by computed tomography scan, and a relatively greater loss of sc abdominal fat. SP-treated women lost significantly less sc fat than the other two groups. Serum cholesterol decreased in the placebo group, but increased slightly in the other two groups (significant for SP vs. placebo, P < 0.05). High density lipoprotein cholesterol decreased significantly in the ND-treated women. There were no significant changes in fasting glucose or insulin sensitivity. We conclude that administration of exogenous androgens modulates body composition in obese postmenopausal women and independently affects visceral and sc abdominal fat.



Effects of androgen therapy on adipose tissue and metabolism in older men.
Schroeder et al, 2004
Source
Department of Medicine and Division of Infectious Diseases, University of Southern California, Los Angeles, California 90033, USA.
Abstract
We investigated the effects of oxandrolone on regional fat compartments and markers of metabolism. Thirty-two 60- to 87-yr-old men (body mass index, 28.1 +/- 3.4 kg/m(2)) were randomized to oxandrolone (20 mg/d; n = 20) or matching placebo (n = 12) treatment for 12 wk. Oxandrolone reduced total (-1.8 +/- 1.0 kg; P < 0.001), trunk (-1.2 +/- 0.6 kg; P < 0.001), and appendicular (-0.6 +/- 0.6 kg; P < 0.001) fat, as determined by dual energy x-ray absorptiometry. The changes in total and trunk fat were greater (P < 0.001) than the changes with placebo. By magnetic resonance imaging, visceral adipose tissue decreased (-20.9 +/- 12 cm(2); P < 0.001), abdominal sc adipose tissue (SAT) declined (-10.7 +/- 12.1 cm(2); P = 0.043), the ratio VAT/SAT declined from 0.57 +/- 0.23 to 0.49 +/- 0.19 (P = 0.002), and proximal and distal thigh SC fat declined [-8.3 +/- 6.7 cm(2) (P < 0.001) and -2.2 +/- 3.0 kg (P = 0.004), respectively]. Changes in proximal and distal thigh SC fat with oxandrolone were different than with placebo (P = 0.018 and P = 0.059). A marker of insulin sensitivity (quantitative insulin sensitivity check index) improved with oxandrolone by 0.0041 +/- 0.0071 (P = 0.018) at study wk 12. Changes in total fat, abdominal SAT, and proximal extremity SC fat were correlated with changes in fasting insulin from baseline to study wk 12 (r >or= 0.45; P < 0.05). Losses of total fat and SAT were greater in men with baseline testosterone of 10.4 nmol/liter or less (<or= 300 ng/dl) than in those with higher levels [-2.5 +/- 1.1 vs. -1.5 +/- 0.8 kg (P = 0.036) and -24.1 +/- 14.3 vs. -2.9 +/- 21.3 cm(2) (P = 0.03), respectively]. Twelve weeks after discontinuing oxandrolone, 83% of the reductions in total, trunk, and extremity fat by dual energy x-ray absorptiometry scanning were sustained (P < 0.02). Androgen therapy, therefore, produced significant and durable reductions in regional abdominal and peripheral adipose tissue that were associated with improvements in estimates of insulin sensitivity. However, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol decreased by -0.49 +/- 0.21 mmol/liter and directly measured low-density lipoprotein cholesterol increased by 0.57 +/- 0.67 mmol/liter and non-high-density lipoprotein cholesterol increased by 0.54 +/- 0.97 mmol/liter (P < 0.03 for each) during treatment with oxandrolone; these changes were largely reversible. Thus, therapy with an androgen that does not adversely affect lipids may be beneficial for some components of the metabolic syndrome in overweight older men with low testosterone levels.


Effects of an oral androgen on muscle and metabolism in older, community-dwelling men.Schroeder et al 2003

To determine whether oxymetholone increases lean body mass (LBM) and skeletal muscle strength in older persons, 31 men 65-80 yr of age were randomized to placebo (group 1) or 50 mg (group 2) or 100 mg (group 3) daily for 12 wk. For the three groups, total LBM increased by 0.0 +/- 0.6, 3.3 +/- 1.2 (P < 0.001), and 4.2 +/- 2.4 kg (P < 0.001), respectively. Trunk fat decreased by 0.2 +/- 0.4, 1.7 +/- 1.0 (P = 0.018), and 2.2 +/- 0.9 kg (P = 0.005) in groups 1, 2, and 3, respectively. Relative increases in 1-repetition maximum (1-RM) strength for biaxial chest press of 8.2 +/- 9.2 and 13.9 +/- 8.1% in the two active treatment groups were significantly different from the change (-0.8 +/- 4.3%) for the placebo group (P < 0.03). For lat pull-down, 1-RM changed by -0.6 +/- 8.3, 8.8 +/- 15.1, and 18.4 +/- 21.0% for the groups, respectively (1-way ANOVA, P = 0.019). The pattern of changes among the groups for LBM and upper-body strength suggested that changes might be related to dose. Alanine aminotransferase increased by 72 +/- 67 U/l in group 3 (P < 0.001), and HDL-cholesterol decreased by -19 +/- 9 and -23 +/- 18 mg/dl in groups 2 and 3, respectively (P = 0.04 and P = 0.008). Thus oxymetholone improved LBM and maximal voluntary muscle strength and decreased fat mass in older men.


Oral anabolic steroid treatment, but not parenteral androgen treatment, decreases abdominal fat in obese, older men.
Lovejoy et al 1995

Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To compare the effects of testosterone enanthate (TE), anabolic steroid (AS) or placebo (PL) on regional fat distribution and health risk factors in obese middle-aged men undergoing weight loss by dietary means.
DESIGN:
Randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial, carried out for 9 months with primary assessments at 3 month intervals. Due to adverse blood lipid changes, the AS group was switched from oral oxandrolone (ASOX) to parenteral nandrolone decaoate (ASND) after the 3 month assessment point.
SUBJECTS:
Thirty healthy, obese men, aged 40-60 years, with serum testosterone (T) levels in the low-normal range (2-5 ng/mL).
MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES:
Abdominal fat distribution and thigh muscle volume by CT scan, body composition by dual energy X-ray absorptiometry (DEXA), insulin sensitivity by the Minimal Model method, blood lipids, blood chemistry, blood pressure, thyroid hormones and urological parameters.
RESULTS:
After 3 months, there was a significantly greater decrease in subcutaneous (SQ) abdominal fat in the ASOX group compared to the TE and PL groups although body weight changes did not differ by treatment group. There was also a tendency for the ASOX group to exhibit greater losses in visceral fat, and the absolute level of visceral fat in this group was significantly lower at 3 months than in the TE and PL groups. There were significant main effects of treatment at 3 months on serum T and free T (increased in the TE group and decreased in the ASOX group) and on thyroid hormone parameters (T4 and T3 resin uptake significantly decreased in the ASOX group compared with the other two groups). There was a significant decrease in HDL-C, and increase in LDL-C in the ASOX group, which led to their being switched to the parenteral nandrolone decanoate (ASND) after 3 months. ASND had opposite effects on visceral fat from ASOX, producing a significant increase from 3 to 9 months while continuing to decrease SQ abdominal fat. ASND treatment also decreased thigh muscle area, while ASOX treatment increased high muscle. ASND reversed the effects of ASOX on lipoproteins and thyroid hormones. The previously reported effect of T to decrease visceral fat was not observed, in fact, visceral fat in the TE group increased slightly from 3 to 9 months, although SQ fat continued to decrease. Neither TE nor AS treatment resulted in any change in urologic parameters.
CONCLUSIONS:
Oral oxandrolone decreased SQ abdominal fat more than TE or weight loss alone and also tended to produce favorable changes in visceral fat. TE and ASND injections given every 2 weeks had similar effects to weight loss alone on regional body fat. Most of the beneficial effects observed on metabolic and cardiovascular risk factors were due to weight loss per se. These results suggest that SQ and visceral abdominal fat can be independently modulated by androgens and that at least some anabolic steroids are capable of influencing abdominal fat.

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You're the man, RonnyT. Very valuable, empirical data. I'm really tempted to add anavar to this cycle, but I think I already may be in overdrive going Test/Tren/Mast after years of not being on the sauce.